undelivered item

Good evening . I bought an item in France .

Today I see that it says delivered but I stayed at home all day and no one ever rang the bell to deliver it and also I checked that there is no item outside my house .

What can I do ? Thanks

maristellgiordan_0

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Posted 3 years ago·Last reply 3 years ago

20 comments

heavenwelkin

·3 years ago

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@maristellgiordan_0 wrote:
What can I do? Thanks

Good evening maristellgiordan_0

On the forum, it’s fairly common to read posts from users complaining that they haven’t received a parcel marked as delivered.

And statistically, it’s impossible that buyers are always lying.

It’s surreal that a courier can have a parcel shown as delivered when maybe they decided to keep it for themselves and/or delivered it somewhere else or decided to hold onto it.

Since there’s no longer a signature requirement (the signature requirement can be requested as a paid OPTION), the courier’s word is worth just as much as the recipient’s.

If you make occasional / infrequent purchases and don’t know the couriers and/or if you buy valuable items, my advice is to always ask for SIGNED delivery.

I’m sorry, but eBay, in the face of a delivery confirmation, sides with the seller.

In my opinion these situations are not RANDOM, for YEARS now a system of distance selling has been FAVORED from above that wipes out the competition, able to offer the buyer security, ease, convenience and absolute guarantee from order to delivery.

- Immediate and direct warranty handled by the monopolist.

- Free shipping even on Saturdays and Sundays.

- Free returns.

- No fear of not receiving the items, since the couriers are directly managed by the monopolist.

- Well-distributed locker point service.

No eBay seller, other marketplace seller, or seller with their own online shop, can even begin to compete at these levels.

And in this case, without even realizing it, the buyer loses out too because they end up with higher selling prices and less offer / choice / variety of items to buy because in the meantime the competition has been wiped out.

Sorry for the inconvenience.

Kind regards.

actar80

·3 years ago

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@heavenwelkin wrote:
Since there is no longer the obligation to sign (the obligation to sign can be requested as a PAID OPTION), the courier's word counts as much as the recipient's.

But is there a law by which they no longer have to get signatures?

In my opinion, it's an excuse that took hold after the covid period, when for safety reasons they no longer made people sign. That way they deliver faster and if they make a mess of things, the recipient is the one who pays the price and they wash their hands of it.

At this point, if there is no longer a signature, it means it's untraceable shipping, which is equivalent to shipping with the classic stamp (the current posta4).

Then, without the signature being affixed, how do you accept the package with reservation or dispute a possible forged signature?

deejaynick

·3 years ago

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Unfortunately, the law exists....
The decree of March 17, 2020 provides, in article 108, that, regarding registered mail, insured mail, and parcel delivery, the recipient’s signature is no longer required.

The typically Italian thing is that it is still in force and no one has repealed it for couriers, only for postal service and limited to "delivery receipts"...

Any objections (received with reservation, etc.) must be made at the time of delivery to the courier (so "someone" has to see it, stop it, make the objection, and he will enter the little clause on the terminal).

Basically, you always need a person under the porch in front of the house, sitting in a rocking chair in Wild West style...

actar80

·3 years ago

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@deejaynick wrote:
Unfortunately the law exists....
The decree of 17 March 2020 provides, in article 108, that, regarding registered mail, insured shipments and parcel delivery, the recipient's signature is no longer needed.

The typically Italian thing is that it is still in force and no one has repealed it for couriers but only for the postal service and limited to "acknowledgements of receipt"...
Thanks, I wasn't up to date; I thought any measure issued during the pandemic had been revoked or at least common sense would suggest that. But you know, in Italy once 1 thing is established there's no going back, just look at the fuel excise taxes for emergencies that even date back to the last century. 😤
I hope that at least for registered letters they make you sign since they have legal value.

Any disputes (accepted with reservation, etc.) must be made at the time of delivery to the courier (so "someone" has to see it, stop him, make the complaint, and he'll put the little clause on the terminal).

In practice, there still needs to be a person under the porch in front of the house, sitting in the rocking chair Western-style...
So in the end it's all left to "let's hope everything goes well otherwise we're screwed!!!" Anyway, this thing needs to be rethought.

milotemesvar

·3 years ago

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@deejaynick wrote:
Unfortunately the law exists....
The decree of 17 March 2020 provides, in article 108, that, regarding registered mail, insured mail, and the delivery of parcels, the signature is no longer needed of the recipient.

But in that same article it says that this measure is valid until 31 July 2020
https://www.agcom.it/tavolo-servizi-postali
https://www.normattiva.it/uri-res/N2Ls?urn:nir:stato:decreto.legge:2020-03-17;18

And the "urgent measures" were repealed on 31 March 2022
https://www.protezionecivile.gov.it/it/notizia/coronavirus-il-31-marzo-si-chiude-lo-stato-di-emergenza

actar80

·3 years ago

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So those who are delivering are taking advantage of it, pretending that nothing has changed.

heavenwelkin

·3 years ago

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@actar80 wrote:
In my opinion, it’s a scam that took hold after the Covid period, when for security reasons they stopped requiring signatures. That way they deliver faster, and if things go wrong it’s the recipient who pays the price while they wash their hands of it.

Exactly actar80

This is an article from 2017 on the DHL blog, published on 6-12-2017, so in "unfounded suspicion" times, well before Covid even arrived.

https://blogecommerce.dhl.it/consegna-pacchi-senza-firma-i-pro-e-i-contro

At the time, delivery without a signature was an OPTION and had to be explicitly requested.

For the courier, delivery without a signature requirement brings a number of advantages that I’ll leave you to imagine....

As you can see by reading this part of the article, couriers are PERFECTLY AWARE of the inconvenience and disadvantages this type of delivery causes for the consumer.

Before Covid, the signature was included in the shipping price; today we’re offered the option to request delivery with signature for the modest price of around 5 euro. 😎

A buyer who pays for an item not received is a buyer who will probably stop buying on that marketplace and drastically reduce online purchases, limiting them to the bare essentials and preferring other buying channels.

Best regards.

deejaynick

·3 years ago

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However, it should be noted that for DHL (and also for UPS) delivery without a signature (at a previously defined location) is optional but can only be enabled by the recipient.
When the courier delivers a package with the ODD option, while scanning the code, they take a photo of where the package is placed in order to "cover their ass" in case of a dispute.
Today’s matter is different, though.
The emergency decree made during Covid that extends delivery without a signature to everyone and everything was supposed to be temporary, but it seems the delivery companies are perfectly happy with it as it is, so it’s still in force...

actar80

·3 years ago

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It’s true that delivery companies are perfectly happy with things as they are, but if it’s still in force, it’s only the government’s fault, for not repealing a law that was supposed to be temporary.

Private companies take advantage of the opportunities handed out by a ruling class that is far removed from ordinary citizens, regardless of political color.

actar80

·3 years ago

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@heavenwelkin wrote:
Before covid, the signature was included in the shipping price; today we’re offered the possibility of requesting signature delivery for the modest price of about 5 euros. 😎
Basically a way to squeeze more money out of poor users; we should rise up en masse, but as we know, in Italy there’s no sense of solidarity and everyone can’t see beyond their own nose.
Regards

milotemesvar

·3 years ago

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@heavenwelkin wrote:

Before covid, signature was included in the shipping price; today we’re offered the option of requesting signature delivery for the modest price of about 5 euros.

Who offers these conditions?*
Until I was selling (July 2022), I don’t remember options like that in PackLink + DHL, nor even when shipping to the Post Office.

heavenwelkin

·3 years ago

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Good morning milotemesvar

As for delivery with signature, every courier has its own options (for a fee); I personally have never used this service because it seemed like a rip-off to me. If I have to spend 7 euros on shipping, I can’t add another 5 euros just for the signature.

The signature is required by eBay itself for international shipments of a certain value, see here:

https://www.ebay.it/help/policies/member-behavior-policies/signature-confirmation-policy?id=5154

As for proof of delivery, every courier has its own

https://gls-group.com/IT/it/spedire-ricevere/servizio-per-te/servizi-accessori/pod

Anyway, I just found out that Amazon requires pickup with a password (to avoid the courier falsifying the signature and/or the person collecting the package denying the signature by claiming not to have received the item) for valuable items.

I don’t like Amazon and I avoid buying from them, but if I had to buy a valuable item I would definitely do it with this new password pickup method.

rurigokou

·3 years ago

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@heavenwelkin wrote:
Anyway, I just found out that Amazon requires a password pickup (to avoid the courier falsifying the signature and/or the person picking up the package denying the signature by claiming they never received the item) for valuable items.
I don’t like Amazon and I avoid buying from them, but if I had to buy a valuable item I would definitely do it with this new password pickup method.

That’s not true... Or at least not around here, I’ve received products worth even thousands of euros and I was never asked for a password, nor did I ever get the email with the supposed one-time password to accept the package. Parcels worth thousands of euros are treated like parcels worth a few bucks(not that these should be handled like crap anyway just because they’re of little value), left unattended by the courier because they don’t want to wait, or tossed at the entrance even if nobody is home. I don’t know where this procedure works, or if it even works, I know it’s supposed to exist, but I’ve never been given the chance, nor has the email ever arrived that was supposed to arrive so I could confirm to the courier that I’m the buyer.

sika700

·3 years ago

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@rurigokou wrote:
That's not true... Or at least not where I live, I've received items worth thousands of euros and I was never asked for a password, and I never even got the email with the supposed one-time password to accept the package....

It depends on who delivers the package to you.

If it's handled directly by Amazon's logistics, I can confirm that they send the password for picking up items even if they're only a little over €500.... and they won't deliver without the code!

If, on the other hand, your area isn't handled by their own logistics and they rely on standard couriers, the system may be different... but that doesn't mean it's not true!

Kind regards.

heavenwelkin

·3 years ago

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@rurigokou wrote:
That’s not true... Or at least not where I live, I’ve received products worth thousands of euros and I was never asked for a password, nor did I ever get the email with the infamous one-time password to accept the package. Packages worth thousands of euros are handled like packages worth a few cents (not that those should be treated like crap either just because they’re worth so little), left by the courier unattended because they don’t want to wait or tossed at the entrance even if no one is home. I don’t know where this procedure works, or if it even works; I know it’s supposed to exist, but I was never given the chance, nor did I ever receive the email that was supposed to arrive so I could confirm to the courier that I’m the buyer.

I can’t really tell you much about the password service because I don’t use Amazon except in very rare cases since I don’t like their sales policies, you might get a refund if....... but that’s not always the case.

This is what happened to a famous product reviewer during the unboxing.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wCrNddD25D8

If this were to happen to an ordinary user buying a MacBook for 2-3000k euros ??

In this specific case I think the courier has little to do with it and the weak link in the chain is in Amazon’s warehouses.

Other pitfalls concern returns that disappear, or rather are declared as "empty box received" and for this reason are not refunded.

Repubblica wrote an article about it in 2021 and in 2023 the problem still persists; here’s a guide that, in my opinion, isn’t worth much because once the package goes into their warehouses anything can happen.

https://www.avvocatoinfamiglia.com/lo-strano-mistero-dei-pacchi-amazon-vuoti-episodio-2/

Still reading reviews and articles, other times Amazon doesn’t accept the return because it says "return not compliant".

In conclusion, if I have to buy a new MacBook with the risk of receiving a MacBook from a previous return, a tracking status showing virtual delivery, or receiving a pepper mill, I’d rather drive 100 km and go to the physical store.

heavenwelkin

·3 years ago

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@milotemesvar wrote:

Who does these terms?*
Up until I sold (July 2022), I don't remember options like that in PackLink + DHL, and not even when shipping through the Post Office

The option with adult signature + 5.41 euro ebay+packlink shipping UPS direct from Germany.

Kind regards.

marioelegio

·3 years ago

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Ask the seller for a copy (a photo is fine too) of their shipping receipt.

If the address and code on the receipt are correct, you’ll only be able to take it up with the courier who made the false declaration.

If the address or code are wrong, you can ask ebay for help: https://www.ebay.it/help/buying/returns-refunds/ottieni-aiuto-per-un-oggetto-che-non-arrivato?id=4042&st=7&po=1&uci=0&ri=0

mario