right of withdrawal and declared actual value at customs
eBay refuses to accept my refund request for an item I never received, which is stuck at the airport because the seller isn’t arranging delivery.
The carrier asked me whether it could deliver the item if I paid the import taxes, and I refused.
The eBay policy (https://www.ebay.it/help/policies/ebay-money-back-guarantee-policy/garanzia-cliente-ebay?id=4210 ) states the following, in the case of "The item was shipped abroad and is stuck at customs because tariffs or duties were not paid": "Covered: The seller declared a value for the item higher than the actual one or provided misleading information about where the item is located, causing customs fees or duties higher than expected"
I argued that the listing value does not represent the product’s value because it also includes shipping costs, and I provided other sites in the country of origin where the product is sold for 100 euros less than the listing value (with "free" shipping)
The listing has the 30-day change-of-mind policy, but according to the policy, I would first have to receive the item, then send it back and hope to get a refund for the import taxes paid (over 100 euros).
Does the right of withdrawal not apply? Don’t I always have the right to a refund even if I haven’t received the goods? Can eBay refuse to respond to my request to know the "actual value" of the purchased product, simply stating that I refused to pay the import taxes and therefore am not entitled to any refund?
Thank you
Regards
ccarerajr
OP3 years agoAlready, all these know-it-alls teaching without reading the rules.
Strangely, luck is always on the side of people who inform themselves and who are able to reason consistently.
sika700
·3 years agoIt's useless clinging to straws... if the tracking was working and the seller had provided verifiable proof of shipment (proof of delivery isn't necessary, since you voluntarily refused it!) you would have been out of luck!
So before lashing out at everyone who was telling you the opposite (everyone, who knows why!) at least have the decency to admit that you got lucky... and read the rules in full... not just the parts that suit you!
Have a nice day.
ccarerajr
OP3 years agoToo bad that it was I myself who admitted to PayPal that I hadn’t collected the product because it violated eBay’s rules, complete with the courier’s attached email asking me to pay the taxes and with personal guesses about the cancellation of the shipment code (item not delivered, code cancelled). Transparent as water.
Better to be lucky and a glass-climber than unlucky like the know-it-alls.
sika700
·3 years agoHey, wake up, you need to read ALL the rules, not just the ones that suit you!
So it’s not at all about being "unlucky like the know-it-alls"... it would never even occur to me to "import" an item and then complain about the import costs!
Knowledge... something unknown to many!!
heavenwelkin
·3 years agoIn fact, it seemed STRANGE to me
How many unsuspecting buyers are there who purchase without realizing that the item is located abroad and/or without realizing that import taxes have to be paid?
The WRONG message that the buyer is spreading is precisely to make those reading this thread believe that PayPal always refunds in these cases, but that is not the case.
Best regards.
ccarerajr
OP3 years agoI think you don't understand Italian, or maybe there are bots with AI here because the gap from the meaning of things is exaggerated.
The table defines proof of shipment or delivery having taken place. It explains how the two concepts are defined. The regulations specify that the requirement of an item not received must be proven with the concept of delivery having taken place.
You are still insisting on the same thing already answered 100 messages ago. The import cost is determined by the declared value. Only someone brainless would accept paying taxes on a declared value higher than the item's actual value.
sika700
·3 years agoI seem to understand that you're quite inclined to understand what suits you... despite the fact that we've reached more than 60 replies where they explain to you how things work.
So, read this page carefully:
https://www.paypal.com/it/webapps/mpp/ua/seller-protection#item-not-received:~:text=%C3%88%20necessario%20fornire%20la%20prova%20di%20avvenuta%20spedizione%20o%20consegna.
it talks about basic requirements... and the table I attached explains the two parts of a requirement to you... I don't think it's complicated.
The additional requirement you're referring to applies if all the basic requirements are met.
You won the dispute because the proof of shipment was not satisfied... but if it had been, the seller would then have provided the proof of delivery handed to him and would have proven you wrong.
So who doesn't understand Italian?
Besides, you don't understand that customs may have "changed" the value of the package based on the volume or the type of goods imported if the declared value was unusual.
But if you don't want to understand it... too bad...
heavenwelkin
·3 years agoIf you go look at the feedback left (not just the red ones) and read many of the green ones carefully, you realize they give him a ton of freebies, there’s someone who gave him shipping with paccocelere1, someone who gave him the lamp, someone the partial refund, rather than a discount ........😎
A particularly LUCKY user to find all these great sellers........
For me, for example, as a buyer it has NEVER happened to receive shipping as a gift despite having made roughly a thousand purchases from 2003 to today....
In any case, since I’m also a seller and luck is blind........ I, not wanting to know or read or write ........ cordially say goodbye to the user ccarerajr and wish them a good life.
Kind regards.
ccarerajr
OP3 years agoYou don’t realize you’re answering yourself.
Whether or not the shipping code was active is irrelevant since the decisive proof is delivery. The code would show that the item got stuck at customs and then was sent back to the sender. Maybe you don’t understand that proof of delivery means collecting the parcel. The level of the know-it-alls is really poor.
Just to be right, now you’re invoking fanciful assumptions about customs having increased the price, ignoring the fact that I’ve written in a thousand different ways that the seller had declared the item value + shipping to customs. It’s not as if, if the declared price is wrong, the problem will be any possible further customs markup on that value. Pure madness, not even worth a reply.
heavenwelkin
·3 years agoMaybe, but apart from your approach toward the forum users
I’m tempted to say, once is happenstance, twice is coincidence, three times is a pattern.
This is the second time you haven’t managed to get the imported item, and honestly I’d ask myself a couple of questions.
If you had followed the procedures, by now you would have had the purchased items and the reversal of the taxes not due (if you were entitled to it).
Because if eBay sided with the seller, do you know what that means?
It means that eBay could no longer take money directly from the seller, and so this PayPal chargeback of yours resulted in a loss of money directly from eBay or perhaps directly from PayPal.
In practice, your recourse was not against the seller but against PayPal and/or eBay, who had to take the loss.
I STRONGLY advise you not to use these practices in the future because you risk being banned from eBay or PayPal.
Best regards.
ccarerajr
OP3 years agoSecond time? Sounds like your supplier’s bringing you good stuff, total madness.
heavenwelkin
·3 years agoThe thing is that all this discussion was set up without clearly specifying the problem with this higher amount, because a private seller has to attach a payment receipt and a professional seller issues the invoice based on what he receives; I don't think he issued you a higher invoice while paying more taxes himself, and I infer this (and I repeat, I infer it, but I’m not certain) from discussion 6 and 7.
Basically, what I infer is that you are disputing the fact that they charged you taxes even on the shipping costs.
Maybe it was a bulky/heavy package, so the shipping costs were high and consequently the taxes were too.
from one of your old posts I quote: " the courier comes to my house and asks me for payment. If I don't accept, he sends it back".
So forgive me if I misunderstood this part you wrote.
Best regards.
ccarerajr
OP3 years agoI’m wrapping up sharing my experience, even though many “professors” preached the exact opposite.
As already explained, eBay ignored my requests to recognize the item’s value, shamelessly violating its own rules.
The courier, after more than a month, was demanding about 600 euros for delivery, as charges resulting from the storage days. They never confirmed whether they would return the item to the sender or not. Later, I checked on my own and found that the item had indeed been sent back to the sender.
I contacted an association that confirmed I could take legal action against eBay for free. They also agreed with my reasons (unlike the professors).
Before proceeding, I tried opening a claim with paypal, so maybe the case could move forward against both of them. Paypal contacted ebay, which only provided the shipping code. Paypal’s rules require a refund based solely on the purchase not being received, regardless of any other event. Curiously, the tracking search with the shipping code came back invalid, as if it had been deleted (maybe the courier deletes the shipping record when it is returned to the sender). In the end, Paypal couldn’t do anything else but refund my purchase. It was a pleasure to discover that Paypal, unlike its own owner (eBay), showed that minimum amount of shame that leads people to respect the agreements they have made.
Therefore, for anyone buying on ebay, the best course is not to pick up items for which you do not agree with the import taxes and, afterward, request a refund from paypal.
According to ebay’s rules, one should pay the taxes, send everything back at their own expense, and then request a refund from customs by proving that the item was sent back... that seems like a reckless route. According to ebay’s rules, by refusing the package, the seller keeps the purchase money and the item itself; in other words, this rule makes unjust enrichment legal, a demonstration of unprecedented uncivil behavior.
Best regards (including to the professors).
heavenwelkin
·3 years agoGood evening ccarerajr
On the forum, answers are provided by users like you based on their experience on the platform.
If more users agree that refusing a package because they do not want to pay the related import taxes is equivalent to hurting yourself, this means it is the wrong way.
It is not only technically wrong but also MORALLY wrong because the import taxes have to be paid; in case of double charging there is a specific procedure to get reimbursed.
You also stated that the shipping/tracking code was INVALID, which is why you were refunded by PayPal.
In conclusion, I do not recommend to users the route/path suggested by you.
Kind regards.
ccarerajr
OP3 years agoI have never talked about not wanting to pay taxes. I was very clear ("do not pick up items for which you do not agree with the taxes"). In my case, I had to pay more taxes than I should have because of the seller's declaration of an inflated value. That is my opinion, notoriously different from that of the professors.
As for the shipping, since I never received the package, even if the shipping code were valid, the lack of delivery would be clear. You cannot have proof of delivery without actual delivery to the recipient. It doesn't get more obvious than that. Paypal's policy is clear: if the package is not picked up or delivered, for whatever reason, a refund is due. All that is left is the professors' crying.
Once again, you are teaching this badly.
The facts vs personal fantasy.
heavenwelkin
·3 years agoIt's not a matter of agreeing or not agreeing with import taxes.
Import taxes are usually 25~26% of the total declared value.
If, during customs inspection for commercial imports, the purchase invoice or proof of payment is not present, which can be a paypal receipt or the ebay order number, the package is not cleared through customs.
You claim that you paid an amount greater than the total you paid (item + shipping), so with invoices / proof of purchase in hand you can contact the Agenzia delle Accise, Dogane e Monopoli and submit a refund request.
Regarding what you wrote, I quote: if the package is not collected or delivered, for whatever reason, a refund is due. It seems rather strange to me that a missed collection or a refusal of the package that goes back to the sender gives you the right to a refund through paypal.
Then I will check, and if you are right I have no problem telling you: you were right.
Kind regards.
sika700
·3 years agoThe moral of the story, you got very lucky!
Period!
Have a nice day.
deejaynick
·3 years agoDearest insistent user:
Whoever knows me knows that my job (the real one, not this one...) is to handle shipments for the Company I work for (and this comes up in many of my other posts...).
That said, I reiterate what I already replied earlier (and which no one can dispute...) and I specify and reiterate that shipping costs FOR THE ITALIAN CUSTOMS AGENCY must be counted together with the value of the imported goods.
Only in the case of the application of duty are they separated: that is why in invoices (real or pro-forma) they are ALWAYS shown as a separate item but they still contribute to the VAT calculation.
Anything else eBay may say clashes with Italian laws (which in this case are also EU laws) and therefore is oppressive (in fact, in the dispute they ruled against you...).
PS: By writing: "(I don't comment on the previous ramblings of other users)" you already replied yourself... 😊
cizeta1964
·3 years ago(I'm not commenting on the previous ramblings of other users)
Hi deejaynick, according to the poster everyone is rambling except him... He reminds me a lot of the guy in the joke, who found all the people driving the wrong way on the highway when it was actually him driving the wrong way on the highway! 😄
heavenwelkin
·3 years ago🤣😂
technopartsbay
·3 years agoI find posts like these very useful instead, with argumentative and nitpicky users who want to be right even when they don't have a leg to stand on.
They’re useful because, together with a careful reading of the feedback from the user in question (received but above all left...), they let you update the black-list.... 👍
heavenwelkin
·3 years agoccarerajr
OP3 years agoThe rules talk about the right not to pick up a package in the event that the seller declares a value higher than the actual value, but everyone says I have to pick it up unconditionally. The rules talk about the actual value of the item (not the sale value or the listing value), but everyone says that shipping costs are part of the actual value.
Everyone points out the clauses that suit their own argument; that’s how it’s been since the world began. The question to verify is whether the clause I raised is invalidated by others or whether it was misinterpreted. As far as I know, it isn’t (no one has shown that the concept of actual value includes shipping costs). Therefore, I still think it’s the others who are cherry-picking convenient clauses, since no one is presenting the rule or the logical interpretation that invalidates it.
heavenwelkin
·3 years agoOkay, let's try changing perspective.
Here it says:
Covered:
Good, have you contacted ebay and what evidence have you provided them to support your argument?
Contact customs and/or the courier, have them send you a copy of the purchase invoice and if it is higher than what you actually paid, contact ebay and have them assist you.
If the seller did not attach a purchase invoice and you were given an estimate by customs on the assumed value, what is stated in that wording is not valid and you must collect the parcel.
Let us know.
Kind regards.
marioelegio
·3 years agoIt seems pretty obvious to me that you have not at all understood the spirit of the regulations and the rules that support them. The phrase the seller declared a value of the item higher than the actual one refers to when the seller declares a value higher than the amount paid in the transaction.
In support of this:
The general rule for determining the value of goods in customs is the value of the actual transaction, that is, the price actually paid or payable for the goods. In order to determine the above value – and provided that they are not already included in the invoice value – the following items must be added to the price:
from: https://www.101professionisti.it/guida/archiviate/approfondimenti/la-determinazione-del-valore-delle-merci-in-dogana-229.aspx
bye
mario
ccarerajr
OP3 years agoIn the same article: "This means that, if the Italian importing Company buys a good with EXW delivery terms from one of its Russian suppliers, and the good has an EXW price of 1000.00= Euro, the value to be declared at customs at the time of import of the good itself must include the cost of transport from the place of taking charge in Russia to the first Community border, plus any insurance costs; these costs will be added to the transaction value and indicated in box 12 of the D.A.U. as “adjustment elements”. If instead the good is purchased with CPT delivery terms (Italian location), the taxable value for duty purposes will be lower than the invoice value because the CPT price includes – together with the value of the good – the cost of transport for the entire journey: consequently the value adjustment will be negative, since from the CPT invoice amount will be deducted – for the purpose of calculating the duty tax base – the transport cost due for the route from the first customs border to destination. It should be noted that in order to be able to make the split for the purpose of determining the duty tax base, transport costs must be indicated separately (Art. 33 Community Customs Code)."
Even if it seems possible to charge *part* of the shipping cost to the price (and this is already enough to prove that the seller is wrong and the warranty must be applied), it remains to be demonstrated that the concept of actual value provided for in the eBay terms corresponds to the concept of "value of goods in customs".
(I won't comment on the previous ramblings of other users)
heavenwelkin
·3 years agoheavenwelkin
·3 years agoYou seem rather CALM to me, and honestly, it makes me suspicious.
DOUBTS about the fact that you REALLY REFUSED the item because they counted the shipping costs.
At this point I think that you picked up the item and then, annoyed, contacted eBay to get a refund and then came to the forum to start this debate.
At this point in the story I REFUSE to believe that you lost both the goat and the cabbage because they taxed the shipping costs too.
marioelegio
·3 years agoWhich, in any case, was right to tax.
hi
mario
ccarerajr
OP3 years agoMaybe that’s why Italy is what it is: rules are not made to be followed. In America, rules have no exceptions. In Italy, with the usual abuse of power, anything becomes an exception just to avoid respecting the rules. Everyone talks based purely on personal conviction.
eBay has a specific policy; it says that the guarantee covers the case where the package is not picked up when the value declared by the seller is higher than the actual value. It couldn’t be clearer. The seller declared a higher value because he also included the shipping cost, and here everyone is making conjectures about other irrelevant issues as if this policy did not exist or were fancifully inferior to other matters, as if eBay’s opinion on the matter were gospel. Indeed, eBay actually does not have the courage to reply to me when I present indisputable facts, when I ask them to define for me the concept of actual value contained in the policy or to tell me what the actual value of the item I bought is.
As I wrote earlier, the only thing that seems debatable here is whether the actual cost of an item includes its shipping, but this is evidently illogical as already argued above and not disputed by anyone; indeed, at most it has been shown exactly the opposite, namely that the Italian legislature has clearly established that, in general, shipping costs are not part of the value of the item.
I understand that it is useless to repeat the same thing in different ways. In order not to admit the application of the aforementioned policy, you talk about something else. Feel free to continue expressing your personal opinions while arbitrarily dismissing the aforementioned policy. Regards.
sika700
·3 years agoThe moral of the story is that you were wrong to live in Italy... so you can move to America... thus avoiding pointless arguments... because if you don't want to understand it, it's true that there is no worse deaf man than one who does not want to hear!
ccarerajr
OP3 years agoObviously, I definitely don't want to hear chatter, I'll just stick to reading the rules, which in my opinion is what matters in every state governed by the rule of law.
sika700
·3 years agoBut what you DON'T understand is that of the rules you only read what suits YOU!!!
heavenwelkin
·3 years agodeejaynick
·3 years agoLet’s say that when it comes to imports our friend doesn’t know much.
In fact, let’s say nothing...
Ebay only “covers its ass” for purchases made with their shipping program (very pricey... but there’s a “why”...).
For everything else, the usual little rules apply, and fees to be paid by the importer, namely:
- VAT on the declared value of the goods* (then we’ll see what the asterisk means...) plus shipping costs.
- Possible customs duty if the amount above exceeds 150 Euro.
- Carrier customs clearance fee (more properly called “customs charges”).
(*) The declared value is the one shown on the pro-forma invoice filled out by the seller but (and here’s the interesting part..) it can be challenged by Customs if deemed not in line with the imported goods.
And in this case there are two paths: the Customs Agency contacts the buyer and asks for proof of purchase or it proceeds on its own to assess the value of the goods.
If it does, the ruling is FINAL until delivery to the recipient, who only THEN can contest the incorrect calculation.
Everything else has already been amply said by the other very good people I’m talking to: eBay and the seller have nothing to do with it: first you have to deal with Customs yourself and ONLY AFTER that go after whoever you want.
Otherwise you lose both goats and cabbages....
heavenwelkin
·3 years agoIt could also be this case, namely that a parcel arrived at customs without an invoice proving its value, or that a value was declared that was too low for its contents, and the customs inspectors went ahead and estimated the value.
Import taxes are paid based on that estimate.
The fact remains that in order to file a dispute, the buyer has to collect the item and pay the taxes on it.
Everything else takes a back seat.👍
deejaynick
·3 years agoLet’s say it’s definitely "the second option"... it’s hard to imagine that in the USA they accepted the package from the sender without an invoice or a declaration of contents.
Anyway, if he wants to keep grasping at straws, he can certainly do so at his own expense.
We didn’t make the "rules"... 😊
heavenwelkin
·3 years agoYeah, exactly. Usually if the sales invoice is missing, the package gets
A) Returned to the sender
B) The sender is contacted and asked to provide the missing documentation
C) (A rather RARE hypothesis), if there is no CERTAIN documentation proving the value, a customs officer opens the package, checks the contents, and makes an estimate of the value.
The “problem” with user ccarerajr is that, according to him, there were PROCEDURAL ERRORS and he doesn’t want to be the one to pay the price for them.
But in these cases you need CONCRETE FACTS; he’s looking for alternative solutions that lead nowhere.
ccarerajr
OP3 years agoAs has been repeatedly emphasized, I received proof from the carrier of the value declared by the seller. Ebay talks about the actual value of the item declared by the seller. All other cases and possibilities are irrelevant.
heavenwelkin
·3 years agoYou did well to contact ebay to hear its opinion based on how you interpreted its statements.
Ebay's opinion was: you are not entitled to a refund.
Now, go and pick up the package right away while you still have time.
Kind regards.
ccarerajr
OP3 years agoIt seems to me that I'm the only one reading the eBay rules, which consider exclusively the value declared by the seller, with no obligation to pick up the package or other variables.
marioelegio
·3 years agoLots of people read it here, but you only understand what suits you.
If you don't pick up the package, that's the end of it. You'll lose it and no one will ever refund your money.
If that's fine with you, go ahead, keep insisting.....
hi
mario
heavenwelkin
·3 years agoAnother one for the books: I find myself with a blunt object stuck in my side and, rather than calling an ambulance, I start arguing with passersby about the circumstances of the accident, the legal regulations, who was in the wrong during the scuffle, about how these things shouldn’t happen, etc. 😎😎
marioelegio
·3 years agoI would have said that he found the object stuck in another spot, which is lower down and on the other side compared to the rib cage.
hi
mario
cizeta1964
·3 years agoEven the many feedback left say a lot about the person...
ccarerajr
OP3 years agoInternational purchases
When the buyer does not receive an item
Exclusions and special coverage when the buyer does not receive an item
The item was shipped abroad and is stuck at customs because tariffs or duties have not been paid
Covered:
Not covered:
heavenwelkin
·3 years agoNot covered:
heavenwelkin
·3 years agoThe seller must attach the customs documentation, including:
- Information about the item that must be shipped to Italy
- Purchase invoice (if you bought it on eBay, they attached the eBay one)
- Declaration of the value of the item as per the eBay invoice.
That said, if you have noticed any inconsistencies, before anything else you MUST COLLECT THE ITEM AND PAY THE RELEVANT IMPORT COSTS.
If you do not do so and refuse, the package will be returned to the sender and YOU LOSE THE ITEM AND THE MONEY.
In conclusion, before you start making excuses, IMMEDIATELY arrange to recover the item you purchased, contact the courier right away (if you are still in time) and pay the relevant import costs.
Then, if necessary, you can open a dispute on eBay.
Kind regards.
ccarerajr
OP3 years agoThe policy says:
"The item has been shipped abroad and is stuck at customs because tariffs or duties have not been paid"
"Covered: The seller declared a value for the item higher than its actual value or gave misleading information about where the item is located, causing customs fees or duties higher than expected"
It doesn't say Covered if he picks it up and pays the fees. Am I wrong?
heavenwelkin
·3 years agoHow do you prove this if you didn't pick up the goods, refusing delivery?
If a package arrives at customs without a sales invoice, customs clearance does not proceed any further and the sender is asked to provide the missing documentation.
So, with the sales invoice attached in the package you picked up, first open a dispute on eBay, comparing it with the one you paid for.
Alternatively, you can do a search on Google with the keyword: reimbursement of duties and/or VAT.
Then you can submit any request for amounts to be reversed to the customs authority.
But if you don't first pick up the package by paying the related customs charges and VAT, you can't do any of this.
Kind regards.
ccarerajr
OP3 years agoI received from the courier all the documents relating to the value declared by the seller.
Anyway, how I prove the value seems to me a matter that does not concern the question being discussed.
On the site, in the rules, it seems clear to me that there is no obligation to collect it. The title is very clear; it concerns situations in which the item is not delivered. The obligation to collect applies only to changing your mind within 30 days. This case is not about changing your mind within 30 days.
I don’t understand why you keep repeating the reason not covered by the warranty, namely non-payment of "customs duties for other reasons," when here we are dealing with the specific cause of a value higher than the actual value, which is a situation that is covered.
It seems to me that here there is little focus on the text of the rules, but rather on prejudices and personal beliefs that cloud its logical interpretation.
sika700
·3 years agoIt all seems off-topic... but where's the consistency?
You're talking about a package never received because the seller doesn't arrange delivery... and then you say the carrier wanted to deliver it to you but you refused...
So... you're already lacking consistency...
Then you talk about an error in declaring the real value of the imported item: do you know what the "real" value is?
The real value of the item is exactly what you paid, shipping included... so here too you're lacking consistency.
You pointed out a site where you would have paid €100 less with shipping included... but then why didn't you buy it there??
Ah, sorry... off-topic...
You're talking about withdrawal... but if you never picked up the package, you can't withdraw from anything!
The moral of the story is, you're trying to "make up" the rules to suit yourself; if you didn't pick up the package by refusing it voluntarily, you can't be covered by any warranty. There's no point continuing discussions whose basis is only pathetic excuses...
So you just need to focus on the nonsense you committed: importing without being aware of customs charges... not knowing that if you refuse a package you can't be covered by anything... not knowing that you can't "compare" your transaction to the value of another similar item... that the real value is the value of the transaction made and not what you "think" the item is worth, that's up to customs!
Put your mind at ease.
Kind regards.
ccarerajr
OP3 years agoThe package is stuck at the airport. The carrier sent an email asking if I intended to pay X in taxes. I have already received packages from abroad in the past; the courier comes to my house and asks me for payment. If I don’t agree, they send it back. Now, however, the package remains stuck at customs and the courier says they are waiting for communication from the seller on what to do. There is no consistency issue, there is only a matter that isn’t detailed because it’s unnecessary for the question.
As already written earlier, if the eBay rules meant the total paid value as the real value, they would have said so in this way. Instead, the rules speak of real value, which in Italian cannot be interpreted as the listing value.
Not by chance, as already pointed out by a user earlier, taxes are paid based on the value of the product, excluding shipping costs (if you think this is not consistent, report it to the legislator or customs, not to me). The shipping cost *can* still be considered if the seller adds it as part of the product value. In the specific case, even if under Italian law the seller can declare shipping costs as part of the product value, eBay does not allow it; it rightly considers it an illegitimate increase in the buyer’s expenses, who could pay less tax if only the real value of the product were declared (excluding shipping).
The eBay rules seem very clear regarding the possibility of refusing a package with a declared value higher than the real value; I won’t repeat it again, just read the previous messages.
I don’t understand why people keep arguing over a literal interpretation of the eBay rules that leaves no room for imagination.
The only debatable thing is whether eBay considers the addition of shipping costs as part of the real value. This is not specified, but it seems like a ridiculous interpretation to me.
sika700
·3 years agoWe can sit here and interpret it as much as you want; whoever takes part in the discussion may have a different interpretation or not... that doesn't mean that if it goes against the writer's ideology, it must be wrong.
The interpretation that you NEED to care about is eBay's; if they said they WON'T refund you, I don't see the point of dragging it out...
Kind regards.
heavenwelkin
·3 years agoYou started a discussion because you have a problem to solve.
What you need is to recover the item or the money.
As things stand, you have lost the purchased item and the money.
If you prefer to FOCUS on the ACCESSORY issues, I personally don't see the point of doing so because I consider it a secondary PRIORITY.
Recover the item, pay what you need to pay, then if you want we can discuss how to obtain a possible refund of the import taxes you paid.
Kind regards.
ccarerajr
OP3 years agoIt seems irrelevant for eBay's rules that in Italy taxes can also be paid on the value of the goods including shipping. For eBay's rules, what matters is the value declared by the seller, not the fact that in Italy it may be right to add the shipping cost as part of the value.
marioelegio
·3 years agoUnder the right of withdrawal, to get a refund you must at least receive and then return the goods. In fact (under Art. 52 paragraph 2 letter b of Legislative Decree 206/05) the right of withdrawal may be exercised in the case of sales contracts, from the day on which the consumer or a third party, other than the carrier and designated by the consumer, acquires physical possession of the goods.
Then in cases of distance selling, under our civil code (art. 1510), delivery of the item must take place at the place where it was located at the time of the sale. So the import into Italy is exclusively your responsibility. You can invoke eBay protection only if the seller declared a higher value than the one you paid, forcing you to pay taxes higher than those that would have been due.
For customs regulations, if the item and shipping costs are paid in a single payment, the total amount counts.
If you don’t believe me: https://www.centroconsumatori.tn.it/139d977.html
bye
mario
ccarerajr
OP3 years agoI’d like someone to look at the cited eBay policy instead of bringing up other issues
The policy does not say to declare a value greater than what I paid.
It says the actual value of the item, which is a very different thing. If someone sells an item by adding shipping costs to the price, does that become the actual value?
When the policy says higher than the listing value or the amount paid, then maybe it could be like that. At present it talks about the actual value of the item. The actual value can only be the market price in the country of origin.
marioelegio
·3 years agoI replied to the issues you raised, also citing the legal provisions (just as you asked).
If you don’t like the answers.....
bye
mario
heavenwelkin
·3 years agoYou took the initiative to buy (IMPORT) an item from a non-European country.
So you are the importer and you have to pay the relevant import taxes.
You made a purchase carelessly and now you would like to shift the responsibility elsewhere, onto the carrier, ebay, the seller......
Best regards.
ccarerajr
OP3 years agoI would like to have regulatory references.
eBay's policy says something completely different.
heavenwelkin
·3 years agoAt this link you can find the regulatory references:
https://rb.gy/fojefx
Kind regards.