Object not collected in Portugal
Summary: The discussion concerns an issue related to the failure to collect an item in Portugal. luciocabrio seems to have started the thread, trying to resolve the matter with the support of marioelegio and heavenwelkin, among other participants. The dialogue develops through various messages and replies, suggesting an ongoing and collaborative communication process to solve the problem.
I sold a model car to a Portuguese guy. so I shipped it by international registered mail to Portugal, to the buyer's home. From what I understand from the tracking, it says the buyer wasn't at home. I'm used to monitoring the tracking throughout the process. So I contacted him via eBay message but he didn't reply. In the following days it said to pick up the parcel at the facility. I promptly warned the buyer but he still didn't reply. He replied to me 6 days later saying that he received nothing and that the postman didn't leave a notice. What happens now? From what I understand the parcel is being processed to come back to me(?)
I told him to look for any sheets/receipts etc. left by the postman or whoever it was.
He replied to me like this:
"In Portugal, even the company that delivers parcels leaves a notice when nobody answers.
The notice, among other information, indicates the place where to collect the parcel.
Without a notice, I don't know if they were at my address, I don't know which transport company it was, and I also don't know where the parcel is.
Please file a complaint with the company that made the delivery (where the parcel was delivered)."
But from personal experience I believe the Italian post office can't do anything.
I found this online:
Complaint: when it is necessary
You only have to open one if the shipment had an obvious issue (lost, tracking stopped, parcel never arrived in the destination country).
It is not necessary if the tracking shows that the parcel arrived and the buyer did not collect it. In that case, responsibility passes to the recipient.
The buyer, if he believes he didn't receive the notice, can open a complaint himself with Portuguese Post.
But that's not the case here.
What can I do? I did my duty, also telling the buyer to go and pick it up twice. I don't want negative feedback, nor to issue refunds, nor to waste time at the post office (unless Italian Post can solve it. Solve what, then? From what I understand the parcel is supposed to return to my house in theory)
what should I do?
I'm attaching the tracking, unfortunately in Portuguese. thanks
- Fri. 31 Oct.16:16Delivery of the item was not successful. - The item was not collected.
- Wed. 22 Oct.10:26The item is available for collection at the Delivery Point.
- Tue. 21 Oct.17:41Left the operational center.
- Tue. 21 Oct.12:33Delivery of the item was not successful. - The recipient did not answer.
- Tue. 21 Oct.10:33delivery not successful due to recipient being absent
- Tue. 21 Oct.9:23The item went out for delivery. It will be delivered during the day.
- Mon. 20 Oct.17:37Arrived at the operational center
- Mon. 20 Oct.13:07Arrived in the destination country.
- Mon. 20 Oct.11:07abroad
- Fri. 17 Oct.4:38at the International Processing CenterPESCHIERA BORROMEO, MI 20068
- Thu. 16 Oct.10:45The item was forwarded to the destination country.
- Thu. 16 Oct.10:17at the International Processing CenterPESCHIERA BORROMEO, MI 20068
- Wed. 15 Oct.1:45Arrived at the operational center
- Wed. 15 Oct.0:45at the International Processing CenterPESCHIERA BORROMEO, MI 20068
- Tue. 14 Oct.10:18datedSESTO FIORENTINO, FI 50019
- Mon. 13 Oct.16:58datedSESTO FIORENTINO, FI 50019
- Sat. 11 Oct.12:11datedCITTA' DI CASTELLO, PG 06018
- Sat. 11 Oct.11:02from one of our operators at the Post OfficeCITTA' DI CASTELLO, PG 06018
- Sat. 11 Oct.12:02The item was accepted. The shipping process has started.
- Sat. 11 Oct.3:31Shipping code provided
luciocabrio
OP4 months agoquick update...weeks ago the package came back...
I contacted the buyer, and we had agreed that he would send me the money for the reshipping...
everything was fine, then when it came down to it he disappeared. I contacted him again... I told him I’d even chip in a bit for the costs by knocking €5 off for him (even though it wasn’t my duty since it was his mistake).
he disappeared.
contacted again. No replies.
So what am I supposed to do? I’m stuck here with this package ready to be resent at home...
in the end, if he’s completely gone, I’ll put it back up for sale and that’s that, right? I mean honestly it even got me stressed out since I went to the post office a full six times for this thing...and this guy disappears???
heavenwelkin
·4 months agoAfter 4 or 5 months, it can also happen that a buyer no longer wants anything to do with it.
After all, it is still a negative experience.
It’s not impossible that it could happen again and the buyer no longer wants to take the risk.
I don’t remember the discussion in detail, but if the buyer is entitled to some kind of refund for the item paid for and not received, excluding shipping costs, maybe you could consider that option.
Regards
luciocabrio
OP3 months agobut he disappeared when we had agreed on the reshipping, both of us were polite and fair in the conversations etc...we talked a lot for months and now that the package had come back and we had agreed, he disappears? I really don't understand. I mean, he disappeared right at the last minute...
I do whatever he tells me... I'm still waiting
luciocabrio
OP5 months agothe guy keeps asking me if the package got home yet...nothing has arrived here.
I hope he doesn’t make a scene...for this whole thing I went to the post office a good 5 times...I did my part...
heavenwelkin
·5 months agoA package can get lost.
What does Poste italiane say about the refund?
luciocabrio
OP8 months agoI received a reply email from Poste Italiane
Dear Customer,
following your request dated 25/11/2025, we would like to provide the appropriate clarifications.
Shipment RC295347986IT is in the process of being returned to the sender. However, the return process could take up to 90 days, after which, if it has not been returned, you may submit a refund request again
I absolutely do not understand why it is taking all this time for the package to come back home
heavenwelkin
·8 months agoThe post office in my city had to rent a space just to handle Temu orders; every day there are several hundred white envelopes piled up between the street and the sidewalk.
They treat everything like it's garbage bags.
It's enough to make you tear your hair out.
The traditional courier delivery system is also having to deal with hundreds of packages a day that each driver has to handle, with parking problems, trouble finding addresses, absent recipients, deliveries piling up.
The amount of packages to handle is growing exponentially and in my opinion home deliveries should be discouraged through paid options for home delivery.
For greater protection for drivers.
They should set up an hub where people go to pick up parcels in each municipality, but a proper one, not those options where they hand over package handling to tobacconists, bars, gas stations and the like, which often only create problems.
Anyway, 90 days is really a long time, and it is obvious that even at Poste Italiane, the situation is quite critical.
Best regards
luciocabrio
OP8 months agoHave you seen how much Italian Post shipping costs? I use them often because I live in a small town. I think they “slip up” by hiring people or renting premises if the workload is like this, right?
€10 for a little package (really small) in Italy is not cheap
luciocabrio
OP7 months agoI’m taking advantage of your reply to ask when you think I’ll be "out of the woods" according to eBay’s timelines.
There’s plenty of proof that it’s not my fault and in theory I shouldn’t have to refund, but this "pending" situation is a bit annoying to me (also for all the time wasted and the risk of getting screwed over)
The buyer hasn’t opened a dispute or anything (weird, right? if I were in his shoes and I had no fault like he says, I would’ve opened it within 30 days of the purchase, no?)
on eBay it says courier scan October 11 (for the shipment), over 2 months have passed. How long does he have to take action against me?
heavenwelkin
·7 months agoIt can happen that a registered letter is delivered but not recorded.
It happened to me that international registered letters were delivered but were no longer shown in tracking, which stayed in a permanent standby state.
But those are of course just hypotheses.
The fact that the buyer did not open a dispute within 30 days from the estimated last delivery date does not mean that he received the item.
Because if he had acted in bad faith, he would certainly have taken advantage of it, and would have immediately opened a claim for item not received.
But not all users are so hung up on these things.
Sometimes you get the calm buyer who doesn’t have a knife between his teeth and doesn’t want to create further hassle, since you did your duty by shipping the item.
Maybe he understood that it wasn’t your fault and didn’t want to open a dispute against you.
Best regards
luciocabrio
OP7 months agosorry, I didn’t mean to say that the buyer wanted to keep the item and pretend it hadn’t arrived...
I mean that I warned him several times about the item being held, and he replied 5 or 6 days later (or maybe he didn’t see the notice, or he lost it, or he forgot to go within the required time, so he knows it’s more his fault than the post office’s)
Anyway, I’ll repeat it: I think the item (maybe) will come back to me, but who knows when. All tracking has been completely lost; nobody knows where it is.
How long does he have to take action? Are there any “forfeiture” deadlines after which he can’t do anything anymore?
I just wanted to be prepared for any eventuality, that’s all.
because the guy had already put his hands up front, saying we should split the reshipping costs when it gets to me (16€ shipping for an item worth barely 10€). No way. If he wants it back, he sends me the shipping money (all of it) and I’ll send it outside eBay because I don’t trust it; otherwise, that’s how it stays. Too many rip-offs are pulled and, if you’re always nice, you end up losing out, unfortunately
heavenwelkin
·7 months agoConsidering that eBay's 30-day buyer protection period has already passed,
The options that come to mind are respectively:
A- Contact the buyer and let them know that nothing has arrived anymore and ask if they want the item back, paying for the item and shipping in full.
B- Contact the buyer and let them know that the item has been returned, so if they want it back they must pay the shipping costs again.
C- The parcel doesn't come back to you, you don't contact the buyer and you wait for them to get in touch eventually.
Remember that the buyer can open a PayPal claim within 180 days of purchase and benefit from PayPal buyer protection (if they paid with PayPal)
If instead the buyer paid by credit card, they can, within 13 months, open a chargeback request with their bank.
Personally I don't think that will happen, but if an extra-eBay claim does happen you will almost certainly have to refund the buyer.
luciocabrio
OP7 months agoSo basically I sell on eBay to be protected as a seller... and if he paid with PayPal or by card (which is totally possible and very likely) I get screwed without even being able to appeal?
I have photos of the tracking, I have proof of shipment, and everything is documented. It doesn’t seem fair or right to me that because of a mistake that wasn’t mine, I’m the one who has to pay for it. And then 13 months for the chargeback means I’ll have to keep all the documentation with me for at least 13 months!
I thought that once eBay has made its decision, or if you didn’t go to eBay... that was the end of it...
luciocabrio
OP8 months agoMeanwhile, almost 2 weeks ago I filed a complaint with the post office. No one has replied to me. The tracking hasn't moved, the package hasn't come back to my place, and the buyer hasn't said anything else...
luciocabrio
OP8 months agoguys, I'm stuck here. The buyer hasn't gotten back to me (so I don't know how they want to proceed). The model still hasn't come home. The tracking hasn't moved since October 31...
heavenwelkin
·8 months agoBut did the buyer open a dispute for item not received?
How did the dispute end?
The eBay dispute is closed after a certain number of days regardless of whether you have received the item back or not.
It will then be your responsibility and concern to contact Poste Italiane if you don't get the parcel back, maybe by opening a claim for a lost item.
Best regards
luciocabrio
OP8 months agoI haven't received any communication regarding the disputes, so the buyer hasn't opened anything yet
luciocabrio
OP9 months agoI add, to show my good faith, that as soon as I saw (I usually keep an eye on my shipments, since I sell very little so it doesn’t cause me any problems) that the recipient was absent, I contacted him with several messages... he replied 6 days later! when it was already too late
heavenwelkin
·9 months agoI checked and for international registered letters that arrive at the Portuguese postal service, 15 days of storage should apply.
Although, judging from the tracking, it seems the storage period was 9 or 10 days (which in any case is a reasonable amount of time to arrange things).
I advise you to close/settle this with this buyer.
luciocabrio
OP9 months agoClose\wrap up in what sense?
Because the situation is tangled and everything depends on whether this blessed little model makes it home.
Because if it doesn’t come back, I have no intention of refunding anything.
And if it does come back and he wants it back, I think it’s right that he pay the shipping again (then he can take it up with his own post office).
Otherwise I’ll give him back the €15 for the little model and we’ll be friends as before (and I want my eBay fees back).
I’m pretty sure that if a dispute is opened, I’d be in the right.
It’s up to him to prove that the post office didn’t come by or that if they did come by, they didn’t leave the slip
heavenwelkin
·9 months agoIn these cases, in the event of a dispute, there are 3 possible scenarios.
A) eBay rules in favor of the buyer
B) eBay rules in favor of the seller
C) eBay rules in favor of both and eBay covers the refund to the buyer (especially if it’s a low-value amount)
If it were up to me (regardless of how any possible dispute turns out) I’d avoid arranging a second sale with this buyer.
luciocabrio
OP9 months agoWhat do you mean by avoid a second sale?
Sell other items or actually send back this model, the bone of contention, if it arrives?
Yeah, but then what do we do? refund? all that time wasted for nothing and then I have to put it back up for sale (and there’s no way he’ll buy it again) etc
Can eBay force me to sell it back to him? or at most force a refund?
as you say, maybe for small amounts eBay covers both
heavenwelkin
·9 months agoThe international registered letter that arrives in Portugal is held at the post office unless someone has explicitly told the postman that they want to رفض the registered letter.
So the possible scenarios could be:
A) The postman rang the bell and, finding no one, left the code to collect the registered letter at the post office. (honestly I doubt the postman didn’t leave a collection notice)
B) The buyer did not become aware of the collection slip (because maybe his wife picked it up and then forgot about it) and let the available days pass.
C) The postman rang the bell and someone answered who expressly told the postman they didn’t want that registered letter, so the postman left no collection notice and the registered letter was sent back earlier than expected.
In that case, POLITELY point out to the buyer that you are waiting for the model to come back to you.
In that case, you will decide whether to send it again through a new purchase or NOT.
luciocabrio
OP9 months agoI thought the same things.
The buyer already knows that I'm waiting, in fact he suggested sending it back to him with the shipping costs split in half (half me).
If he's not in agreement, he may ask eBay to intervene. And this is where I don't understand what eBay could do. If it comes to nothing and I get the model back, do I put it back up for sale? but then the customer pays twice... I don't know
luciocabrio
OP9 months agoAll of this, obviously, if this blessed little model makes it back to my place
luciocabrio
OP9 months agoI went back to the post office, they even called the office, nobody knows where the package is
heavenwelkin
·9 months agoWhat does the tracking say?
Did the package get lost in Portugal or did it come back to Italy and disappear?
luciocabrio
OP9 months agoThey don’t even know themselves. It seems, and I say seems, that it’s back in Italy (and that makes sense, it’s been a month now since I shipped it.
In the meantime, just a few minutes ago the buyer got back in touch:
"Good morning.
When you receive the package, please check that the address is correct and send it back.
If the address is correct, since it wasn’t your fault or mine, if you agree, we can split the cost of this second shipment."
Like, someone explain this to me... I shipped a little model worth €15 (+€15 for tracked shipping) and now I’m supposed to pay €7.50 to send it back to him? I’ve already been to the post office 4 times for this thing (queues and it’s not close to my house), I know I’ve done everything right, I tried to help him and now I have to pay if he or his post office made a mistake?
Then when you take off eBay fees, commissions (even on shipping costs) in the end how much do I actually have left?
I mean, at least the other buyer bought 2 more models and I sent everything back, but he never even dreamed of asking to split the shipping costs.
I politely refused and said I could resend it (and go to the post office yet again) at his expense, or I’d give him back the money for the model
heavenwelkin
·9 months agoOn the well-known A****n site, any item that is not delivered (for whatever reason) is refunded.
This "bad habit" has certainly also influenced ebay, which does not always take a firm position in favor of the seller when it happens that a buyer does not pick up an item.
luciocabrio
OP9 months agoAnd then the shipping costs more than the model itself, and if I had to send it back I’d do exactly the same thing I’ve done so far, the data is what it is... what if they’re wrong? We’d have the same problem again.
And I repeat, why this inconsistency? In eBay tracking I clearly see recipient absent... while the postal one is so bare-bones. It used to be more detailed
heavenwelkin
·9 months agoIt happened to me with a UPS shipment in Germany, delivery failed because of an incorrect address and eBay ruled against me, I appealed and they confirmed the ruling against me.
You just have to hope that eBay rules in your favor, sometimes it does and other times NO.
Best regards
luciocabrio
OP9 months agoI asked the AI to maybe understand how it works. here's what it wrote
Documentation required for Portugal
Full address of the recipient: name, street, house number, postal code, city, country.
Shipping label correctly filled out at Poste Italiane.
Acceptance receipt that you already have (proof that you shipped it).
Any additional services (e.g. return receipt) must be clearly indicated on the envelope.
👉 The CN22/CN23 customs declaration is not required, because there is no internal customs in the EU.
🔎 So why does “incomplete documentation” show up then?
It’s a generic translation used by Poste Italiane’s system when it receives a “return” code from the foreign partner.
In reality, as you saw from the Portuguese tracking (CTT), the real reason is that the recipient was not present and did not collect the parcel from storage.
Poste Italiane does not always faithfully report foreign details, so the wording can be misleading.
⚖️ Implications on eBay
With the CTT tracking (the detailed one that shows “recipient absent” and “not collected”), you can prove that the shipment was made correctly.
In the event of a dispute, eBay considers valid the tracking that shows the delivery attempts and the non-collection: so the responsibility falls on the buyer, not on you.
Poste’s wording (“incomplete documentation”) should not worry you: it does not mean you did something wrong, but only that the Italian system poorly simplified the information it received.
I mean guys, I have the receipt here with me and the address matches what I wrote on the slip myself (then if the postal workers made a mistake when transcribing it, that’s another matter and we’ll see)
That said, in the eBay tracking it’s clear that the recipient is absent. It says so.
This happened to me another time months ago, delivery in Spain... recipient absent and there too the postman did not leave any notice.
the buyer apologized, bought 2 other models and had everything resent, which then arrived regularly.
let’s say I think I did everything properly, why should I pay for someone else’s mistake?
Refund ok, in the meantime the model has to come back to me. Then that model was wanted by someone else too and it ends up that I don’t sell it since I don’t think the buyer wants to pay shipping again to get it back (and I’m scared of feedback or something similar too). More hassle, runs to the post office, etc. Then who tells me they didn’t leave him the slip? or maybe he was on vacation or lost it? I warned him well in advance too, he could have intervened... instead he didn’t get in touch for a week. And now I’m supposed to file a complaint according to him? it says in Portuguese what happened, let him go to his post office and ask (that’s what I advised him)
heavenwelkin
·9 months agoThe international registered mail also includes free return delivery, so a failed pickup would also correspond to the return of the registered item.
If eBay sides with you, the buyer, because of his negligence and carelessness, loses the item and the money.
If eBay sides against you, you would have to absorb the shipping cost and the selling fees, unless during the dispute you decide on your own to refund him without waiting for eBay to decide in your favor or in the buyer’s favor.
As for the feedback, you could EVENTUALLY ask for its removal because it is certainly not your fault if the buyer did not pick up the item.
Best regards
luciocabrio
OP9 months agoWhat would you do in my place, knowing you did everything correctly and in good faith?
heavenwelkin
·9 months agoI would get in touch with eBay Germany to have them assist me, since there are many assistants there with decision-making power who can change the outcomes of disputes.
But you need to be comfortable with German.
Best regards.
luciocabrio
OP9 months agobut eBay still isn’t involved. no dispute. (I don’t know German)
Anyway I went to the post office and....the mystery deepens
I had them pull up the tracking there. it says that on October 17 it arrived at the destination OE....and on October 20, (last recorded date) "arrived via a dispatch from abroad ITLINAPTLISAAUR50196 the postal center" what does that mean?
At the post office they told me that the package, since October 20, according to the wording above, is in Italy...but that seems like nonsense to me...how is that possible? in 3 days it’s already back? why didn’t it get back to my house then? and why does the tracking stop on the 20th? Where is this damn package?
What do I do?
heavenwelkin
·9 months agoAI is not 100% reliable; they often make mistakes and/or omissions and sometimes give outdated answers.
In this specific case I advise you to forget about the AI because with eBay you never have absolute certainty of winning a dispute.
luciocabrio
OP9 months agoShould I go check at the post office?
daxsisko
·9 months agoto sum up (and anyway as already pointed out by the other users who replied..... ) : in the case (very likely) that the buyer opens a dispute for item not received, eBay will decide the outcome of the dispute....... and the result is not a foregone conclusion.....
PS: I remind you that it’s possible to indicate which countries you ship to and which you don’t ........ at the time Portugal, for various reasons, I had put in the list of those to which I didn’t ship......
luciocabrio
OP9 months agoBut I sell if it says well 5\6 times a year, in Portugal I must have shipped maybe once, how come you "crossed it off"?
daxsisko
·9 months agoin short: considered unreliable ( 2 shipments , 2 "problems" ) , I didn’t give him a third chance.....
luciocabrio
OP9 months agoOn the postal website I find a compact tracking where it says :
marioelegio
·9 months agoBased on what’s written on the compact tracking, you’ll be forced to get a full refund or send it back at your own expense.
hi
mario
luciocabrio
OP9 months agoThe extended tracking is the one they see on eBay though, and it speaks for itself. Then sorry, but I have the photo of the filled-out registered letter with all the details and they’re the ones the buyer entered